Stream: snomed
Topic: Possible meeting Amsterdam Nov 19
Grahame Grieve (Jun 13 2019 at 14:01):
Hey All (e.g. @Rob Hausam @Michael Lawley @Russell Leftwich @Laura Heermann @Jay Lyle @Michelle (Moseman) Miller @Michael Padula @Michael Tan @Stephen Chu @Susan Matney @Jean Duteau @Ted Klein @Reuben Daniels @Robert McClure @Carol Macumber)
I've just been speaking to Jane Millar about Snomed's analysis of the FHIR value sets for
- Condition.clinicalStatus
- AllergyIntolerance.clinicalStatus
- AdverseEvent.outcome
(see https://confluence.ihtsdotools.org/display/FHIR/Free+SNOMED+CT+set+for+FHIR and sub-pages)
The Snomed analysis of these is troubling - they don't have lots of matching concepts, and they asked some hard questions of the HL7 design. It seems to both Jane and I that these elements should have strong mappings between FHIR and SNOMED CT, and that to progress this we need a solid focused discussion between HL7 (PC/Vocab) and SNOMED.
We cast around for options to do a face to face to this, and are proposing to our respective communities that there's a window of opportunity for us to meet in Amsterdam on Nov 19 (day before DevDays Amsterdam) to discuss this - there's a realistic possibility that enough of us from both communities could be present to have a meaningful discussion.
Any thoughts about this?
Carol Macumber (Jun 13 2019 at 16:26):
Unfortunately AMIA is running that same week in DC (Nov 16-20). Might be a conflict for many of us.
Grahame Grieve (Jun 13 2019 at 16:27):
ah yes, And I'll be at AMIA over the weekend... but how many people will be? too many?
Carol Macumber (Jun 13 2019 at 16:28):
Not sure, at least a handful of the folks mentioned here. Personally, I have to be at AMIA through Monday, I could possibly leave and be in Amsterdam for the 19th to help represent Vocab at this face-to-face
Grahame Grieve (Jun 13 2019 at 16:29):
that'd be tight given you lose 10 hours or so
Carol Macumber (Jun 13 2019 at 16:29):
lol...i've done worse ;)
Grahame Grieve (Jun 13 2019 at 16:29):
I'll be leaving Sunday evening
Robert McClure (Jun 13 2019 at 19:41):
AMIA runs Nov 17-20 and I'll be on at least one presentation that I don't know when it will happen. I suspect many of the folks here will be there. I may not be a required participant but I think we need to find a better slot to meet. I wonder if everyone, including SNOMED will be in DC for AMIA and we could meet there, say on the 15th instead?
Michael Lawley (Jun 13 2019 at 21:20):
I'll likely be in NZ, but @Jim Steel will likely be in Amsterdam and @Alejandro Metke will be at AMIA
Grahame Grieve (Jun 13 2019 at 21:40):
Well, I can do a meeting before AMIA in USA. I don't think that the SNOMED people will be able to
Ted Klein (Jun 14 2019 at 10:57):
I won't be at AMIA, but I may still be in Korea - some post-ISO activities in November have not yet been finalized.
Gay Dolin (Jun 14 2019 at 19:41):
@Grahame Grieve @Robert McClure @Carol Macumber You forgot about me :-(
Gay Dolin (Jun 14 2019 at 19:47):
I like @Robert McClure 's idea
Carol Macumber (Jun 14 2019 at 19:48):
@Gay Dolin my sincerest apologies! I could make the 15th in DC work.
Grahame Grieve (Jun 14 2019 at 21:13):
Apologies @Gay Dolin - I could've listed a lot more...
Gay Dolin (Jun 14 2019 at 21:20):
No - worries. I know
Adam Flinton (Jun 17 2019 at 08:34):
Blimey is this finally rearing it's head? Had this in NHS days & kept the ehr model types from the terminologists via a "what happens in vegas" rule. i.e. there is a fundamental mis-match of context. a code has no context (or shouldn't have) i.e. it is what it is what it is whereas in an ehr it is what is it because of where it is i.e. structural context). e.g. High vs low - altitude, dose or mental state? Potentially you could use post-coordination to give a code "context" but.... it's a bit hacky.
Grahame Grieve (Jun 17 2019 at 08:56):
there is a context problem. But irrespective of this, the basic notions should be representible allowing for context slipperiness. THe analysis suggests that currently they are not. So I think that there is a problem on either side, or on both
Grahame Grieve (Jun 17 2019 at 18:01):
November is a problem... Jane is pushing for us to do this at the SNOMED Meeting in Malaysia at the end of October. It's physically possible for me to make it (briefly) but who else from HL7 will be there?
Rob Hausam (Jun 17 2019 at 20:10):
I will be at the SNOMED meeting in Malaysia - my Expo submission was accepted.
Jim Steel (Jun 17 2019 at 23:23):
@Michael Lawley will be there I believe
Michael Lawley (Jun 18 2019 at 00:00):
Yes, we'll have several people there with an interest in this topic.
Reuben Daniels (Jun 18 2019 at 12:55):
I am more likely to make it to Malaysia than Amsterdam or AMIA at this stage.
Reuben Daniels (Jun 18 2019 at 12:56):
Would Atlanta be too soon?
Adam Flinton (Jun 18 2019 at 13:22):
Could create precoordinated expressions but then selecting the right one for the right use in the structure would become an interesting challenge & possibly a potential area for errors.
Grahame Grieve (Jun 18 2019 at 17:44):
it seemed unlikely that any decision makers from Snomed would make Atlanta
Robert McClure (Jun 20 2019 at 14:55):
When is the SNOMED Malaysia meeting? I can start the process of asking to travel, might be unlikely. Any chance we can support virtual participation?
Grahame Grieve (Jun 20 2019 at 19:19):
there's always a chance... it's just a question of bandwidth
Grahame Grieve (Jun 20 2019 at 19:20):
https://10times.com/snomed-ct-expo-malaysia
Grahame Grieve (Jun 20 2019 at 19:20):
or https://www.snomed.org/news-and-events/events/snomedct-expo
Carol Macumber (Jun 20 2019 at 21:02):
I will be in KL
Carol Macumber (Jun 20 2019 at 21:02):
I will be in KL
Grahame Grieve (Jun 20 2019 at 21:07):
we have enough terminology people. just not enough PC representation. Not sure whether that's a fatal problem
Rob Hausam (Jun 20 2019 at 21:17):
I can represent PC, too. But it would be nice (even if not quite essential) to have at least one or more of the others.
Grahame Grieve (Jun 20 2019 at 21:18):
right - you, but one more would be good. not much chance though, I think
Peter Jordan (Jun 20 2019 at 21:55):
Possibly @Stephen Chu?
Rob Hausam (Jun 20 2019 at 22:28):
Yes, I thought of Stephen (and just now got off the PC FHIR call with him and several others, in fact). But I wasn't sure exactly how feasible it is to travel from Australia to Malaysia and whether it would be for him to come to a SNOMED meeting. It would be great if he could, though.
Jay Lyle (Jun 20 2019 at 22:34):
If Stephen can't, maybe PC can deputize Rob H in some kind of preliminary meeting, possibly in ATL. I'll check with my clients about going but won't be holding my breath.
Carol Macumber (Jul 16 2019 at 15:13):
Any progress on determining if a meeting will be arranged in KL?
Grahame Grieve (Jul 17 2019 at 11:19):
well, yes, in that I will be on the Sunday for a meeting. So anyone who can make it will be welcome
Grahame Grieve (Jul 17 2019 at 11:19):
You should contact Jane for further details - sorry I have been slow on this - still out on leave
Carol Macumber (Jul 19 2019 at 15:33):
ok, will do. I'll post back here any details from Jane
Carol Macumber (Jul 31 2019 at 15:20):
Hi All - Meeting has been confirmed for the morning of Sunday Oct 27th in KL. Time and Room TBD.
Last updated: Apr 12 2022 at 19:14 UTC
