Stream: terminology
Topic: Use of UTG
Melva Peters (Sep 23 2020 at 15:56):
I'm no sure if this is the correct place to ask this question - if not, can someone please point me to the correct stream. I'm trying to use UTG to search for possible value sets to use as exemplar bindings. I had hoped to be able to go to UTG and search for values and come up with possible value sets that include the value or values. I don't see a way to do this. Where do I go to get How to Document on UTG? There doesn't seem to be a link to How To documentation that I can see from UTG - I just want how to use it and the features, not how to submit a proposal, etc. Thanks.... @Ted Klein @Jessica Snell
Jessica Bota (Sep 23 2020 at 16:18):
Hi @Melva Peters . The base IG (which UTG is built off of) does not currently support searching of values across artifacts as I understand it. We don't specifically have a How To for the UTG pages, but we do have a video for navigating through them. See the Unified Terminology Governance Section at the bottom of https://confluence.hl7.org/display/VOC/Vocabulary+Maintenance+at+HL7 to access that video.
My suggestion would be to download the entire release and search through the 'source of truth' folders for the values of interest.
Grahame Grieve (Sep 23 2020 at 16:19):
I will add search to UTG next week
Jessica Bota (Sep 23 2020 at 16:20):
@Grahame Grieve WOOT! I think that will be an awesome addition. Looking forward to it :)
Melva Peters (Sep 23 2020 at 16:23):
That seems a lot of overhead to be able to search and I think search is key functionality that should be available. Not sure how to submit a change request, but I'm happy to do so. This documentation needs to be more prominent on the HL7 space and not buried on the Vocab Work Group space if you want members to start using UTG (IMHO).
Jessica Bota (Sep 23 2020 at 16:25):
@Melva Peters, looks like Grahame is way ahead of us and will be adding search! I certainly agree it will be a powerful tool. As for bringing attention to the UTG pages on the HL7 space, I am going to add this to the agenda for the next UTG/Vocab call so we can discuss how to best approach that. I appreciate the feedback.
Melva Peters (Sep 23 2020 at 16:29):
@Jessica Snell is there a way to find the webinar in the Education on Demand? I've searched through all webinars and can't find it.
Jessica Bota (Sep 23 2020 at 16:32):
@Melva Peters I had an issue finding it on there too. I was able to find it if I was logged out only. I tried to reproduce this with several others and it seemed I was the only one affected. Mel Stewart should be able to help us, but I am curious to know if you can get to it logged out.
Melva Peters (Sep 23 2020 at 16:47):
well, that makes no sense - you should get access to the same free content as when you're logged in. I'll send my question to Mel and Sadhana.
Melva Peters (Sep 23 2020 at 16:51):
@Jessica Snell you're right...it's there if you are logged out. That makes no sense! I have emailed Sadhana and Mel.
Ted Klein (Sep 23 2020 at 17:37):
sorry just got to this now been helping Sean McIlvenna getting started submitting change requests for things he needs for cda 2.0 core publications. Melva we have in gigantic text in bold on the entry page for the Confluence Vocabulary Space "Vocabulary Maintenance at HL7". I dunno how we can make it more prominent than that without it being on the front page for hl7.org
Ted Klein (Sep 23 2020 at 17:37):
Search will be great once Grahame gets it implemented
Ted Klein (Sep 23 2020 at 17:38):
Now all we have is being able to browse the content based upon the groupings of Code Systems, Value Sets, V2, V3, etc.
Ted Klein (Sep 23 2020 at 17:38):
Folks really do need to watch the intro webinars to see how this stuff is all organized, sorry do not have anything less burdensome than that
Jean Duteau (Sep 23 2020 at 17:49):
Ted Klein said:
sorry just got to this now been helping Sean McIlvenna getting started submitting change requests for things he needs for cda 2.0 core publications. Melva we have in gigantic text in bold on the entry page for the Confluence Vocabulary Space "Vocabulary Maintenance at HL7". I dunno how we can make it more prominent than that without it being on the front page for hl7.org
@Ted Klein I search for UTG and get terminology.hl7.org. There is no link to webinars, how-to documents and any documentation at all. There is a small link on the home page that says "See further UTG project details". Clicking on this link takes me to a description of the project but no information on how to use UTG nor how to get content into it or anything.
I have to decide to click on the "UTG Tooling and Proposal Documentation" link in the space page list. On this page, there is a COMING SOON around submitting a proposal and a link to a youtube video around reviewing and voting. There are also a couple of other youtube sessions that indicate they are intros and indepth discussions of terminology and the UTG process.
This is all very confusing and not amenable to newcomers to UTG to understand what they can and cannot do nor to users like Melva and I who are suddenly being asked to create new code systems and value sets within UTG.
There needs to be a page IN THE UTG IG ITSELF that provides links to documentation and to webinars and videos. I shouldn't have to search random HL7 confluence pages to find this documentation.
Grahame Grieve (Sep 24 2020 at 07:21):
well, I can't easily fix those things, though I generally agree with them all. But I have added search to UTG
Melva Peters (Sep 24 2020 at 12:43):
@Grahame Grieve Thank you! is it in the current build or in the next release?
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 12:56):
Jean, so sorry this is confusing. Let me talk with DJ about updates to the main page to link to https://confluence.hl7.org/display/VOC/Vocabulary+Maintenance+at+HL7
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 12:56):
I have not been able to discuss how this should be best organized with anyone from Education.
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 12:57):
The decision was made a long time ago to NOT link to Confluence pages in the Publisher generated build pages in the IG itself
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 12:58):
And the decision had been made to explicitly separate the publication of the HL7 Terminology (terminology.hl7.org) from the maintenance process (UTG).
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 12:58):
I would be happy to have a chat with you to get your suggestions of the best way to make this better for all of us.
Lloyd McKenzie (Sep 24 2020 at 13:29):
Ted, can you share why the decision was made not to have the UTG IG pages link to the confluence instructions?
Lloyd McKenzie (Sep 24 2020 at 13:30):
It seems like a no-brainer to me, and is certainly easy enough to do...
Melva Peters (Sep 24 2020 at 13:49):
The documentation also needs to be linked from the HL7 space in Confluence under HL7 Tools and processes.
At this point, there isn't a that I can find on the HL7 Space of UTG. You shouldn't have to wade through pages of material on the Vocab space to find something this important. I'm happy to work with you Ted to help with making the documentation clear and understandable. I understand you want to work on education, but we need clear documentation as a first step.
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 14:31):
Grahame told me and indicated that was an FMG/FHIR-I policy that IGs should not link to web pages outside of themselves. Perhaps I misunderstood
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 14:32):
Melva, the plan for that was as part of the rollout but we do not yet have the official decision from Austin and Wayne on go-live rollout to do that
David Pyke (Sep 24 2020 at 14:32):
UTG should be a special case as, as I understand it, it's not a FHIR IG to be implemented by someone outside of HL7? Linking to Confluence makes perfect sense for this case
Lloyd McKenzie (Sep 24 2020 at 14:33):
That's definitely not policy and not true. We have lots of IGs that point to external pages
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 14:33):
well then I am happy to put that in no problem
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 14:34):
I am just VERY unclear as to what policies and good practices for 'regular' IGs pertain to UTG and which do not
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 14:35):
I would REALLY like to have folks who have NOT been involved (Jean, Melva, etc) to have. short session with me to identify critical items we need to adjust ASAP
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 14:38):
and we ABSOLUTELY want to change the link in the boilerplate banner at the bottom of the built pages to go to the correct links for "Propose A Change". I have NO CLUE if that url would be in the templates @Lloyd McKenzie or part of the internal stuff in the Publisher @Grahame Grieve
Grahame Grieve (Sep 24 2020 at 14:48):
is it in the current build or in the next release?
Neither. It's in the current release
Grahame Grieve (Sep 24 2020 at 14:49):
we can add it to the current build too. I'll see about that
Grahame Grieve (Sep 24 2020 at 14:49):
Grahame told me and indicated that was an FMG/FHIR-I policy that IGs should not link to web pages outside of themselves. Perhaps I misunderstood
I think so. I recall saying that UTG should not contain the documentation, not that it should not link to iut
Grahame Grieve (Sep 24 2020 at 14:50):
change the link in the boilerplate banner at the bottom of the built pages to go to the correct links for "Propose A Change"
What's that link?
Rob Hausam (Sep 24 2020 at 14:53):
(deleted)
Rob Hausam (Sep 24 2020 at 14:54):
(deleted)
Vassil Peytchev (Sep 24 2020 at 14:59):
About search: I just did search for "ICD" (on terminology.hl7.org), expecting to find something, but I got:
No results found for ICD site:M:\web\terminology.hl7.org\1.0.0. - is the site shown an indication of a problem?
Grahame Grieve (Sep 24 2020 at 14:59):
oh crap.
Grahame Grieve (Sep 24 2020 at 15:01):
try again
Vassil Peytchev (Sep 24 2020 at 15:04):
All fixed!
Melva Peters (Sep 24 2020 at 16:10):
Ok, I clearly am missing something. Where do I find the search capability? I was hoping to be able to search for values and come back with a set of value sets that include that value. How else will I figure out if a value set already exist that I should consider using rather than create a new one?
Vassil Peytchev (Sep 24 2020 at 16:14):
Magnifying glass
image.png
Robert McClure (Sep 24 2020 at 16:16):
Folks, we're running as fast as our little legs can take us all the while running a WGM :-P Please see UTG Documentation
Melva Peters (Sep 24 2020 at 16:27):
I don't see that. Is it browser dependent? HL7_TERMINOLOGY_HL7_Terminology_Home_Page_-_FHIR_v4_0_1.jpg
Grahame Grieve (Sep 24 2020 at 16:28):
might need to refresh
Melva Peters (Sep 24 2020 at 16:29):
@Robert McClure I realize that, I'm trying to sort out search which I'm told exists but I don't see it.
Jean Duteau (Sep 24 2020 at 16:29):
@Melva Peters Although I don't see the hourglass on the build version, I just found out that we shouldn't actually be looking at terminology.hl7.org. We should be accessing the current build at build.fhir.org/ig/HL7/UTG.
In the meantime, please make sure you are accessing UTG from the current build as Version 1.0.0 (terminology.hl7.org) was a prototype to debug the content, process and tooling. The content there is insufficient and should be consumed with that in mind.
Grahame Grieve (Sep 24 2020 at 16:30):
I haven't added search to the current build yet. that will take more time. I have to research currency issues
Melva Peters (Sep 24 2020 at 16:31):
Okay...I'll back off for now...
Ted Klein (Sep 24 2020 at 18:37):
Yes please EVERYONE - the published released v 1.0.0 at terminology.hl7.org is the INITIAL release which was primarily to test and debug the process and pieces; the content there is out of date (badly), and incomplete. I will no longer pay any attention to comments about that version, everyone should be looking at what is now 1.0.42 (I just pushed 1.0.43 and it is still building) for the current state of the HL7 Terminology.
Frank Oemig (Sep 25 2020 at 08:39):
I am currently trying to download (and install) the tools. Can it be that the link is broken?
Grahame Grieve (Sep 25 2020 at 09:23):
which tools?
Jessica Bota (Sep 25 2020 at 13:11):
The Windows FHIR Toolkit from http://www.healthintersections.com.au/FhirServer/. (sorry, cross-posted in the utg stream as well)
Grahame Grieve (Sep 25 2020 at 15:16):
oh. hmm
Grahame Grieve (Sep 25 2020 at 16:39):
should be fixed
Jessica Bota (Sep 25 2020 at 18:59):
Still rerouting to another page for me: http://www.healthintersections.com.au/FhirServer/fhir-toolkit-install-0.0.65.exe/
Grahame Grieve (Sep 25 2020 at 19:32):
caching issue on your side - remove the trailing /
Jessica Bota (Sep 28 2020 at 13:27):
Thanks Grahame. Cleared my cache and works that way as well.
Last updated: Apr 12 2022 at 19:14 UTC
