Stream: argonaut
Topic: DocumentReference.custodian
Yunwei Wang (Mar 25 2022 at 18:54):
US Core 4.0 (http://hl7.org/fhir/us/core/STU4/StructureDefinition-us-core-documentreference.html#mandatory-and-must-support-data-elements) state that:
The organization responsible for the DocumentReference SHALL be present either in DocumentReference.custodian or accessible in the Provenance resource targeting the DocumentReference using Provenance.agent.who or Provenance.agent.onBehalfOf.
Is this a "Each DocumentReference must have" type of requirement or "Each DocumentReference must support" type of requirement?
Yunwei Wang (Mar 28 2022 at 17:07):
@Eric Haas
Brett Marquard (Mar 28 2022 at 17:09):
Must have. log a tracker to clarify
John Moehrke (Mar 28 2022 at 17:12):
must would be a dramatic difference from MHD/XDS. I thought we were trying to allow them to be used together?
Brett Marquard (Mar 28 2022 at 17:14):
appreciate you pointing out that concern -- just to make sure I understand -- in MHD/XDS there is no expectation, even in the provenance resource, you can identify the org responsible for the DocumentReference?
John Moehrke (Mar 28 2022 at 17:17):
IHE has not used .custodian, as it is a very specific concept that has not been in XDS from the beginning. There is expectation for the id to be that FHIR server that hosts the resource instance; and the .author would tend to have an organization in it. Distinction between author organization and custodian has not been seen as a need or anything currently done.
John Moehrke (Mar 28 2022 at 17:18):
what is the argonaut distinction between author organization and custodian? When would they be different? A distinction without a difference seems redundant.
Brett Marquard (Mar 28 2022 at 17:20):
In Argonaut/US core we didn't add any requirements on Custodian either...we didn't disallow it, but we said you had to have the organization responsible in either DocumentReference.custodian or Provenance.
Brett Marquard (Mar 28 2022 at 17:22):
I am struggling to follow your statement on author organization when looking at the minimal MHD profile...no additional requirements on author
Brett Marquard (Mar 28 2022 at 17:22):
maybe I should be looking elsewhere?
John Moehrke (Mar 28 2022 at 17:24):
we did not get so strict so as to make the real-world impossible. so no, you will not find a mandate for author organzation, but it is common to fill author with organization. policies like this would tend to be regional/community/affinity-domain
John Moehrke (Mar 28 2022 at 17:24):
Brett Marquard said:
Must have. log a tracker to clarify
I was reacting to this... which seemed to indicate you were clarifying that .custodian was a "MUST".
Eric Haas (Mar 28 2022 at 17:26):
based on my recollection is more common IRL to have the organization than an author.
Eric Haas (Mar 28 2022 at 17:27):
and I think we are in alignment there
Eric Haas (Mar 28 2022 at 17:27):
and Yes .... in US Core our goal is to "get so strict so as to make the real-world impossible". ;-)
Brett Marquard (Mar 28 2022 at 17:29):
No, custodian is not a MUST
Brett Marquard (Mar 28 2022 at 17:29):
Custodian is not even a MUST SUPPORT
Brett Marquard (Mar 28 2022 at 17:29):
The underlying requirement is an organization must be responsible for the DocRef published.
Brett Marquard (Mar 28 2022 at 17:30):
My request was to log a tracker to clarify --
John Moehrke (Mar 28 2022 at 17:46):
then we seem to be back to harmony
Yunwei Wang (Mar 28 2022 at 17:49):
Last updated: Apr 12 2022 at 19:14 UTC
